Bill 13 Off Road Vehicle Act for BC

tomcycle

Past President DSBC 2004 -2018
Staff member
BCORMA has done a lot of good things, but its not for me to tell you what they were, I will leave that for the communications team at BCORMA.

Setting aside my personal opinions of anyone at BCORMA, I have a problem with how BCORMA handles its finances. I pretty much stand alone out here on this.

Since 2006 BCORMA has paid out well over $400,000.00 in Executive Director wages/expenses. I wonder if BCORMA has gotten good value for our money? Regardless of how good a job the Executive Director has done, can BCORMA afford the annual expense of over $70,000.00 for an ED that cant or wont provide the communication that is required? Is BCORMAs model broken or just have to be put back on the tracks?

T
 

DirtClunker

Active member
OK, lots of ideas and opinions. Its easy to post up stuff in this thread. Its more difficult to do something about it.

What about action?

We need to be unified as to a course of action or else it will all just fall apart.

There have been a few suggestions as to action - is anyone interested in actually *doing* something about this? I am, yet I dont want to be a solo voice, and I am not interested in being the one and only.
 

tomcycle

Past President DSBC 2004 -2018
Staff member
Presently our representative is Scott604, he is just outside the inner circle, DSBC did not appoint him as a director of BCORMA, has no vote. This was done to protect him from any legal responsibilities that he may not be aware of when he volunteered to the position.

Scott has done the best he can as a volunteer, perhaps a new face with a little more aggressive approach is required? Any volunteers, I have not spoken to Scott about this but I am sure he would appreciate the help. I am of little use other than to provide some history as I have worn out my welcome with BCORMA.

With a new face and voice perhaps my skewed view of BCORMA could be a bit more balanced? Or maybe my view is not so skewed?

Tom
 

tomcycle

Past President DSBC 2004 -2018
Staff member
yea it seems to have that effect when you call on volunteers. who wants to get into a punch up?

I have done my time, sending out another sacrificial lamb to sit on the board and think they can get answers and provide change is little more than a pipe dream. The present board is quite happy with who they have and present agenda. Im sure they would like for some new people to join in, but change is not what is wanted, the ED needs some drones to follow his instructions. (not my cup of tea)

First we have to find out if BCORMA is truly repenting off road riders. Saying you do is not the same as doing. Trust Us does not work, send us money because we need it is lame. BCORMA is going to have to hire/steal/beg someone to improve their image.

T
 

DirtClunker

Active member
I must admit - sitting on the board at BCORMA is right up there with pulling teeth and hydrochloric enemas.

How about something whereby people can get involved, but not to the extent and commitment of beating it out in meetings.

Is anyone interested in putting their name to a "diplomatic" letter to the president of BCORMA, stating the various concerns and asking for specific things to be done? It would only be the first step. Not a big commitment. The idea would be to see if we could get BCORMA to remain the same people, but change how they communicate, involve members and be open with their books. I figure it is fair to ask before blasting the guns and pulling out the heavy handedness.

Don
 

Mad Max

New member
I must admit - sitting on the board at BCORMA is right up there with pulling teeth and hydrochloric enemas.

How about something whereby people can get involved, but not to the extent and commitment of beating it out in meetings.

Is anyone interested in putting their name to a "diplomatic" letter to the president of BCORMA, stating the various concerns and asking for specific things to be done? It would only be the first step. Not a big commitment. The idea would be to see if we could get BCORMA to remain the same people, but change how they communicate, involve members and be open with their books. I figure it is fair to ask before blasting the guns and pulling out the heavy handedness.

Don
Take the ball and RUN WITH IT DON...I nominate YOU!!:f::f::f::f::f::f::f:Any seconds?
 

tomcycle

Past President DSBC 2004 -2018
Staff member
Don

If you are truly interested I think we should have a conference call so you know what you might be getting yourself into. In fact maybe we should have a on line meeting for anyone that wants to hear or learn more. DSBC has an executive so I will present this to them so they are up to speed. Then we can move forward

T
 

DirtClunker

Active member
Like I said before, I am interested to take action - not being a rep though. I dont want to spend my time on ferries to vancouver to sit in a friggin meeting. I do than from 9-5 every day and hate it. I also dont want to be a solo pain in the arse voice, so I am happy to lead a limited charge (e.g. letters, phone calls, etc) *IF* I have support from lots of people. So if the people who have been commenting about BCORMA are willing to put their name to a letter, I am happy to write it, vet it with the group, send it to the BCORMA exec and follow up on it. Rather than start off with guns blazing I would like to start positive, just to see if we can effect a change with the current organization.

I would also like help from the people who have been commenting on the thread. I would like them to contact their exec from their home offroad mc clubs, to see if these clubs have any beef with BCORMA as well.

I have been down this road many times (with other organization) and success usually comes with a majority backing and a positive, non-threatening approach.

But until then - its the long weekend! I got two rides planned for a mini OK vacation - yippee!

Don
 

offworlder

Moderator
DC et all,

I'm committed (or should be) to participating. Count me in for letter writing, phone calls, bad language, and more :rolleyes:.
This is unacceptable behaviour (on the part of BCORMA), and as there's alot at stake for the sport we all love, in the immortal words of DOA: Talk - Action = Zero !
 

North

Active member
I too can participate in letter writing, phoning, etc.

Please correct me if am I wrong. This is all a done deal. But, it is going to have ongoing amendments. So we need to worry about the future changes now. The Government is dealing with BCORMA and we need to be represented correctly through it.


What you have just posted makes a lot of good sense Don.

Rick
 

tomcycle

Past President DSBC 2004 -2018
Staff member
Interesting replies guys.

99% of what you are contemplating on doing is easily done from your home computer. Maybe we should extend an olive branch out to BCORMA and offer to help with communications. Tell them what we see wrong and what we could do to help? And see what BCORMAs response is?

TT
 

offworlder

Moderator
Not sure whether the inference is (us keyboard jockeys) we're lazy or... :confused:
Regardless I'm in for whatever the "team" decides. Tom's experience and insight is valuable (as always), shall we put forth a call for participants, and call a vote ?
 

DirtClunker

Active member
North - yes the OHV act is a done deal. They way it was handled by BCORMA is what we are complaining about. What we want to change is how BCORMA interacts with riders, improve their communications, involve the actual riders and have open books.

Tom - yes I am with you 100%. Try the nice way first and see where that leads us.

Offworlder - maybe its laziness, I am not sure. I do know that if we make it really easy for keyboard jockeys to voice an opinion, they'll do it.

I am just out burning it up in the OK/Lilloette. When I get back later in the week, I will draft something up and see what you guys think.
 

North

Active member
From what I have read here, the Government recognizes BCORMA as a voice of off-road riders in BC. So we can either work through BCORMA or form a new group and petition the goverment through it. So, working through BCORMA does seem to me to be the best first choice.
 

skidmark43

Administrator / BFF in the blue jacket
BCORMA News Release – November 21, 2014

BCORMA News Release – November 21, 2014

Provincial Government's voluntary ORV registration and the date for mandatory registration is now public!
BCORMA News Release – November 21, 2014

Provincial Government's voluntary ORV registration and the date for mandatory registration is now public!

The ORV Act was passed in Spring 2014. The Government is now bringing in voluntary registration, with mandatory registration in 2015. The voluntary registration period started on November 17, 2014 and mandatory registration will start on June 1, 2015.

Ken McClelland (BCORMA President) and I have fought hard for the better part of a decade to get dirt bikers the best deal under the ORV Act. BCORMA continues to work on key details of the rules and regulations surrounding the ORV legislation. Many additional regulatory and policy components still need to be worked on prior to mandatory registration on June 1, 2015. This includes vehicle identification and insurance requirements for road crossings among others.

Plates are still an issue for dirt bikers and snowmobilers, and all MLA need to be made well aware of it. Ken and I are still pushing hard on the issue and thought we had gotten somewhere, but we have nothing but soft "we think we are doing this" discussions to go on.

We worked to get the best deal we could considering the Government's objectives and stance on core issues. What the Government wanted was safe and sustainable recreation on Crown Lands. Our job was to show them how we are are safe and sustainable.

BCORMA negotiated:

Reduced youth rider supervisor age down from 25 years old to 19 years old with a valid driver's license
An “allowance” for taxes due on private sales before July 2010
Ability to cross roads at legal crossings
Appropriate vehicle ID and placement by vehicle type. That means for dirt bikes we can mount our identification on our front number plate. While we continue to push for decals on our fork tubes, this is better than a rear mounted plate.
No required lighting except under adverse or after-hours light conditions.
Required lighting for dirt bikes would be limited to a portable strap on light that allows other vehicles to see you.
Youth riding age for Crown Lands at six years old, not sixteen as proposed by other groups. The Government has insisted that youth riders be properly supervised and riding in a safe manner.
No requirement for 3rd party insurance to ride on Crown Lands under the ORV Act. FSRs still require 3rd party insurance and a driver's license.
Taxes have always legally been due on used and private sales, and the Government considers that non-negotiable. After a letter to the Deputy Minister and many discussions with the Ministry of Finance where we recommended a grace period from tax payment on used motorcycle sales, the Government has provided a window. Not close to what we recommended, but much better than their position that taxes were due on the value at the time of the transaction period.

My suggestion is that you contact the Government Manager of the file or your MLA, and discuss your concerns and questions. You can reach Vera via her Blackberry at: 250.889.9192 BCORMA needs all dirt bikers to express their views directly to Vera and their MLA if we hope to have Government listen to our recommendations. With upwards of 15% of BC households having one or more ORV, we represent a large block of votes.

Give me a call in Williams Lake or Ken in Kamloops to discuss the ORV Act. If you prefer a more free-form discussion by BC dirt bikers, please go to BCORMA's Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/11140817555/

Because of BCORMA continuing Trail Pass Program, we have put $1000s of funds into off-road motorcycle trails. For 2015, we will be leading a $433,500 BCORMA Trails for Tomorrow trail works project across the BC. Vedder, Squamish, Kamloops, Revelstoke, Bear Creek, OK Falls, IOCO, Blue Mountain, to Bull Mountain at Williams Lake will be getting new and rehabilitated trails, staging areas, signage, and bridges. That's trails for your kid's kids to ride on.

We have some of the best riding in the world because of BCORMA's constant drive and the work of all our dedicated Directors and myself.

Peter Sprague, MSc.
Executive Director
BC Off-Road Motorcycle Association
http://bcorma.ca
[email protected]
250.398.5251 Williams Lake - summer
250.412.3444 Victoria – winter

Official BC Provincial Government information on their new ORV Act implementation

Here is the link to the ORV News release re voluntary registration et al: http://www.newsroom.gov.bc.ca/2014/11/off-road-vehicle-registration-available-monday-nov-17.htm

The main ORV Management Framework webpage has been updated to include the new dates for voluntary and mandatory registration:

http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/mof/orv/

Note: here’s the weblink to the news release regarding the Off Road Vehicle Act achieving Royal Assent on March 24, 2014: http://www.newsroom.gov.bc.ca/2014/02/orv-legislation-will-keep-bcs-backcountry-safe.html

Attached is the final version of the bulletin that has now gone out to Law Enforcement and Safety - it is now a public document.

Attached ORV Sales Tax Bulletin is also public:

Vera Vukelich has asked us to direct any questions from members or the public about sales tax to Ministry of Finance’s toll free number at 1 877 388-4440 or they can email questions to [email protected]

Information is also available on this Ministry of Finance website: gov.bc.ca/pst

Stakeholder associations can contact Joel Fairbairn directly at Consumer Taxation Programs Branch, at 250 387-1118 or by email at [email protected].

The Government has asked for all media queries to be directed to:

Greig Bethel
Media Relations
Ministry of Forests, Lands and Natural Resource Operations
Phone: 250 356-5261
Email: [email protected]

All other concerns or questions should be addressed to your MLA or Vera Vukelich, Manager, Land Policy and Programs.

Vera Vukelich | Manager, Land Policy and Programs | Land Tenures Branch | Tenures, Competiveness and Innovation Division | Ministry of Forests, Lands and Natural Resource Operations | PO Box 9308 Stn Prov Govt, Victoria BC V8W 9J2| Location: 4th Fl - 780 Blanshard St | PH: 250 356-7040; BB: 250 889-9192; FX: 250 356-6791
 

ron

Senior Member
I went to my insurance agent to register my craigslist purchased off-road bikes. Looks like bikes purchased after 2010 are subject to 12% back tax in order to be registered. If original bill of sale is not available, a statutory declaration is required. Low balling the sale price could be questioned, same as street legal sales. It appears all future private sales will be subject to the "small registration fee" as well as the "not so small 12% tax". They will give you a plate but they don't know where it should be attached. I imagine if plate falls off they will sell you another one.
 

tomcycle

Past President DSBC 2004 -2018
Staff member
Lots of discussion on registration on the BCORMA and PNWMA facebook pages

Few Answers.

Remember, don't get mad at the registration regarding the tax owed, Thats the taxman your mad at. He is way better at collecting taxes than we are avoiding them
 

Bora20

Administrator
Mount plate inside spokes of the front wheel for now. That is where I have seen the Alberrta guys mount them.
 
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